Is it wrong for women to wear pants?

[TigerShadow]

But did you know it wasn't normal for women to wear pants until World War 2? Women wore dresses and skirts and you could tell if someone was a girl.

So are you saying that we should let values from seventy years ago determine how we dress now? Not to mention the implication that just because a woman is wearing pants she can be confused as being a man.

But if I am the only girl wearing a skirt in a room full of people, I feel like if someone never got to talk to me and only saw me from a distance, they'd probably think I went to church.

It would depend on a lot more that just the fact that you're wearing a skirt; it depends on what kind of pants other women are wearing, the material of your skirt, and probably the weather as well. If you're just wearing a skirt in a room full of people wearing pants, most people won't really care. All they notice is a fashion choice. If, however, it's an ankle-length skirt made of thick, coarse fabric in ninety-five degrees while everyone else is wearing shorts, then yeah, people are going to take notice, and honestly, they'll probably be more put off because people associate that kind of dress with ultraconservative radicals, even if that's not what you actually are. (I'm not saying that this is what you personally would wear, don't get me wrong; I'm just trying to say that it takes more than wearing a skirt to get people thinking that you go to church, and that trying to say "I go to church" by what you wear can be off-putting to people if not done right.)

[gabbygirl17]

But did you know it wasn't normal for women to wear pants until World War 2? Women wore dresses and skirts and you could tell if someone was a girl.

So are you saying that we should let values from seventy years ago determine how we dress now? Not to mention the implication that just because a woman is wearing pants she can be confused as being a man.

But if I am the only girl wearing a skirt in a room full of people, I feel like if someone never got to talk to me and only saw me from a distance, they'd probably think I went to church.

It would depend on a lot more that just the fact that you're wearing a skirt; it depends on what kind of pants other women are wearing, the material of your skirt, and probably the weather as well. If you're just wearing a skirt in a room full of people wearing pants, most people won't really care. All they notice is a fashion choice. If, however, it's an ankle-length skirt made of thick, coarse fabric in ninety-five degrees while everyone else is wearing shorts, then yeah, people are going to take notice, and honestly, they'll probably be more put off because people associate that kind of dress with ultraconservative radicals, even if that's not what you actually are. (I'm not saying that this is what you personally would wear, don't get me wrong; I'm just trying to say that it takes more than wearing a skirt to get people thinking that you go to church, and that trying to say "I go to church" by what you wear can be off-putting to people if not done right.)

I was just saying that women wearing pants wasn't recognized till recent. (If 70 years counts as recent Haha!)

And in grocery stores since my mom and I wear jean skirts and no jewelry or makeup people tend to stare. Not that I'm trying to say we do it for attention. No, not at all. Trust me. We've had people ask us about church or about our hair (since we don't cut it) That's what I meant by being a witness in the way we're looked at.

[TigerShadow]

I was just saying that women wearing pants wasn't recognized till recent. (If 70 years counts as recent Haha!)

I'm just wondering why that makes a difference. :/

As to how you choose to dress, hey, if it's a good witness, then more power to you. I'm not going to tell you to do something if it's your conviction not to do it.

[gabbygirl17]

I was just saying that women wearing pants wasn't recognized till recent. (If 70 years counts as recent Haha!)

I'm just wondering why that makes a difference. :/

As to how you choose to dress, hey, if it's a good witness, then more power to you. I'm not going to tell you to do something if it's your conviction not to do it.

Haha! I meant that women wearing pants wasn't the norm till recently. And true. We all have different personal convictions.

[GabrielleFandomGirl]

But God never changes His mind though!

Are we still under the law of Moses? No, we aren't because Jesus became the new law, so God didn't 'change his mind', replacing the law was all of his plan from the beginning.

So, as Christian said, if you are going to pick out that verse and say that it still applies, what about the other laws of Moses?

But God never changes His mind though! We are to be set APART from the world not of it! Also Men in the Bible times wore pant like things under their robes. Women didn't. Can you back up your thing with Scripture? In the Bible it says to be MODEST....pants on women is not modesty...

Where in the bible does it say that the definition of modesty is wearing dresses?

Also if I went out in the world how could I tell which people are Christians if I looked just by the way they dress???? They wouldn't "stand out" like we are told to do in the Bible.

Standing out isn't just a matter of dressing. You can still tell someone is a Christian even if they are wearing pants, if they show the light of God. Even if a girl is wearing a skirt, it doesn't mean that she is a Christian.

Are we still under the law of Moses? No, we aren't because Jesus became the new law, so God didn't 'change his mind', replacing the law was all of his plan from the beginning

.

I already posted something about that: Also there are things that we have to "update" because of our culture....BUT that we dont need to on pants.

How can you tell if someone is a Christian if they wear pants? If you just saw them from the outside. If you saw a girl that: wore a skirt, no jewelry, very modest, and looked modest what would you think? (sorry If I am offending anyone)

Post subject: Re: Is it wrong for women to wear pants? Reply with quote
@Gabby pants on women are very modest!

How?

How not, I think is the better question. Something skin tight, for instance is really quite immodest, but suppose the pants are loose, not drawing unneeded attention to the woman's bottom, and hips, etc, then what is wrong with them?

[John Henry]

Pants being modest? This idea is argued in Judaism as well. Most Jewish groups are against women wearing pants, but some groups think that pants are modest. I don't know about pants that are not form-fitting. Nowadays, women hardly wear such pants. In Korea, the only times I see women wearing such pants are the eldery and some middle-aged. Long time ago? I don't know, but nowadays they have these skinny jeans which tend to be form-fitting to attract the man's eyes on the woman's body.

[Eleventh Doctor]

Nowadays skinny jeans are one type of jeans, a specific subset of pants overall, that can be worn. There are many, many other types of pants. You're again claiming that all women wear the same pants, that's just not true. Plenty of women of all ages wear modest pants that aren't form fitting.

[Audrey]

Well, I just spent a half hour reading this entire thing. And wow. d=

I'll give my two cents: There is nothing wrong with women wearing pants. At least to me. If you want to wear skirts, good for you! I applaud you for that. But do not expect every woman to wear a skirt because of YOUR convictions. I wear jeans. Skinny jeans, in fact. I know, I know. What a shock. I must be causing men to lust after me! Trust me when I say that not all skinny jeans are indeed "skinny". They're just named that because they don't flare out at the bottom, unlike a lot of women's pants. I don't like that style, so I choose to wear jeans that could be considered "skinny". Compared to many other skinny jeans out there, I don't find mine immodest. They cover me and aren't super tight. That is my opinion, and I don't plan to change it.

Honestly, at this point I'm like "Wear what you want, as long as it makes you feel good about yourself." I've noticed my opinion on this is quite different than what other people believe. d= I'm in college three days a week, so I see a lot of people walking around in every sort of outfit. And as long as it's not super scandalous, I don't see a problem with it. If that's what makes you feel good, what can make you walk around with confidence and say to yourself "I like how I look today", go for it. There's so many girls who aren't comfortable with how they look. So if they think they look great in not-so-loose jeans and a v neck shirt, who are you to deny them?

I'm being a bit brash here, so excuse me. d= But I as a girl do not plan my wardrobe around what makes YOU comfortable. I'm sorry if you're lusting after me. But I cannot control you. I am not asking for it. I wore this outfit to make myself feel good, not to attract you. If men are looking at me as some sort of object, that is not my problem. Because frankly, even if I dressed in a berka, they will either still lust or there will be a girl in a crop top and short shorts walking by. It's going to happen. You cannot avoid it. Sorry, but welcome to the 21st century.

This might be a bit difficult for some people (mainly guys xD) to get, but most girls don't dress for guys' attention. I like how I look in skirts and dresses that are inches above my knees. I don't wear them because I want guys fawning over me. I wear it because I want to. Sure, there's limits to what I wear. But those limits exist because I know what I am comfortable with.

Look, everyone's different. Everyone has different standards. I wear things that many people on this board would consider immodest. But I can't dress to your standards. What I like to wear may be super conservative for someone else, or be really immodest. So I will dress how I believe is okay for me. Because how women dress isn't up to anyone but the woman herself.

[Wakko]

I'm a guy and next time I get jeans, I may get skinny jeans. =o Shocking I know. Also, I'm not against women wearing pants. I'm sorry if I have just majorly offended some of you by saying that, women can wear pants and I may get a pair of skinny jeans. =p

[gabbygirl17]

Well, I just spent a half hour reading this entire thing. And wow. d=

I'll give my two cents: There is nothing wrong with women wearing pants. At least to me. If you want to wear skirts, good for you! I applaud you for that. But do not expect every woman to wear a skirt because of YOUR convictions. I wear jeans. Skinny jeans, in fact. I know, I know. What a shock. I must be causing men to lust after me! Trust me when I say that not all skinny jeans are indeed "skinny". They're just named that because they don't flare out at the bottom, unlike a lot of women's pants. I don't like that style, so I choose to wear jeans that could be considered "skinny". Compared to many other skinny jeans out there, I don't find mine immodest. They cover me and aren't super tight. That is my opinion, and I don't plan to change it.

Honestly, at this point I'm like "Wear what you want, as long as it makes you feel good about yourself." I've noticed my opinion on this is quite different than what other people believe. d= I'm in college three days a week, so I see a lot of people walking around in every sort of outfit. And as long as it's not super scandalous, I don't see a problem with it. If that's what makes you feel good, what can make you walk around with confidence and say to yourself "I like how I look today", go for it. There's so many girls who aren't comfortable with how they look. So if they think they look great in not-so-loose jeans and a v neck shirt, who are you to deny them?

I'm being a bit brash here, so excuse me. d= But I as a girl do not plan my wardrobe around what makes YOU comfortable. I'm sorry if you're lusting after me. But I cannot control you. I am not asking for it. I wore this outfit to make myself feel good, not to attract you. If men are looking at me as some sort of object, that is not my problem. Because frankly, even if I dressed in a berka, they will either still lust or there will be a girl in a crop top and short shorts walking by. It's going to happen. You cannot avoid it. Sorry, but welcome to the 21st century.

This might be a bit difficult for some people (mainly guys xD) to get, but most girls don't dress for guys' attention. I like how I look in skirts and dresses that are inches above my knees. I don't wear them because I want guys fawning over me. I wear it because I want to. Sure, there's limits to what I wear. But those limits exist because I know what I am comfortable with.

Look, everyone's different. Everyone has different standards. I wear things that many people on this board would consider immodest. But I can't dress to your standards. What I like to wear may be super conservative for someone else, or be really immodest. So I will dress how I believe is okay for me. Because how women dress isn't up to anyone but the woman herself.

I've heard many people say that it's the guys fault for lusting. Yes, it may "happen all the time" BUT the girl can try to lessen it. It's also the woman's fault. You should try to dress in a way that glorifies God and in a way that lessens guys lusts. You may "dress the way you want cause you feel good that way" But that doesn't help guys out there. Romans 13:14 says Rather, clothe yourselves with the Lord Jesus Christ, and do not think about how to gratify the desires of the flesh.

And Romans 14:13 says Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in the way of a brother or sister.

13-23 says: Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather determine this—not to put an obstacle or a stumbling block in a brother’s way. 14I know and am convinced in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to him who thinks anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean. 15For if because of food your brother is hurt, you are no longer walking according to love. Do not destroy with your food him for whom Christ died. 16Therefore do not let what is for you a good thing be spoken of as evil; 17for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. 18For he who in this way serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men. 19So then we pursue the things which make for peace and the building up of one another. 20Do not tear down the work of God for the sake of food. All things indeed are clean, but they are evil for the man who eats and gives offense. 21It is good not to eat meat or to drink wine, or to do anything by which your brother stumbles. 22The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves. 23But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin.


So we need to be careful how to present ourselves.

[TigerShadow]

I agree with both gabby and Audrey.

If a woman dresses in a revealing way knowing what people are going to think and how they will act, she should not be surprised that people are lusting. If there is lust at all and she did this on purpose, it is, in fact, partially her fault. The man is, of course, also clearly at fault, which Jesus took special care to point out in the Sermon on the Mount when discussing adultery, but if the woman placed a stumbling block there knowing that it was a stumbling block and choosing to place it there anyway, then she is also partially to blame.

But let's say a woman is wearing a skirt instead of pants. I cannot stress enough that men will still lust after her. Skirts can accentuate the hips and legs as much as pants can, no matter how modest they are. A woman can dress with the intention of modesty and still be lusted after. That is unquestionably the man's fault and only the man's fault. No matter who put the stumbling block there, the man's sin is at the root of his lust, not the woman's.

I would also like to point out that what constitutes as "too revealing" differs from person to person. Some women are perfectly okay with wearing pants, some aren't. Some are perfectly okay with wearing short shorts in hot weather, some aren't. It's going to differ from person to person.

[Eleventh Doctor]

Nope not the girls fault, unless you're saying a girl is like food or alcohol in which case stop objectifying women. Dress for God and no one else, which includes not dressing to please people who say you should cover up to avoid tempting a guy. If that worked then there wouldn't be rape in countries where women have to wear burkas but it does.

[Audrey]

Question, Eleventh Doctor: When you say dress for God, what does that mean?

[TigerShadow]

(I'm just going to assume that for the purposes of discussion, we are talking about Christians relating with Christians here, because expecting that the rest of the world adhere to our dress code is, frankly, unreasonable.)

I'm just wondering why it's so unreasonable to ask women to take some responsibility in how they look knowing that men, in general, tend to be more visual in terms of sexuality than women are. :/ This is coming from a woman who wears tank tops and shorts in public, too, so this isn't about me trying to force a "dress code" on anyone. Shouldn't we make the effort to try to help our brothers in Christ instead of recklessly or negligently hindering them?

With what you said in mind, Eleventh, what about that verse in Romans 14 that gabby posted, about not placing stumbling blocks? Isn't saying that Christian women get a free pass to dress however they want and flaunt themselves around Christian men, who are evil and totally at fault if they're tempted to lust, a bit like a completely sober person attending an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting and placing several open beers around a recovering alcoholic and then criticizing them for being tempted back into their old habits? (I'm not comparing women to alcohol; I'm simply comparing the temptations and how they would affect the people in the respective analogies.) It's one thing to say that a man should have to be able to deal with self-control in the general public, where there are going to be stumbling blocks regardless, and quite another when he's at church or on an outing where he's only hanging around other Christians; shouldn't these types of venues be places where no one has to worry about their brothers or sisters in Christ placing a stumbling block in their path?

[Eleventh Doctor]

When I say dress for God I mean that to be up to the individual.

This idea that men are more visual in terms of sexuality is a myth. I'm not sure where this comes from but I hear this all the time and it's stated as general knowledge when in fact I've never heard any evidence for this. As for helping others I can see your point. I'm not saying women or men for that matter get a free pass to dress and act however they want but I don't like this comparison of people to objects and you just compared women to alcohol, you saying you're not doesn't make the comparison go away. I realize you're saying you're comparing the temptations but the temptation comes from the object.

[TigerShadow]

I don't like this comparison of people to objects and you just compared women to alcohol, you saying you're not doesn't make the comparison go away. I realize you're saying you're comparing the temptations but the temptation comes from the object.

The analogy could use some work; I was attempting to compare lust to alcoholism, not women to alcohol. :/ But I see the point, and I concede it.

[John Henry]

1. Not just pants, but skirts are equal in modesty or inmodesty when it comes to being form-fitting.
2. Yes, many women wear it because they do not realize that men can be tempted by the lust of the flesh.
3. @Eleventh, you've mentioned that a lot. True, that happens, but which way can the lust of the flesh be more common? Covered or Uncovered? I would like to wonder why women are so daring in trying to uncover their skin, and people in the church allow that when even the Apocrypha is against nudity. (1 Maccabees) Could you explain, please?
4. Let's suppose there are modest pants. But, I do not understand your definition.
5. Short-Shorts, Okay? Nowadays many young women in my country wear shorts that barely cover the buttocks. You may say, because it's hot, but even in the winter all they do is add leggings. Now why would they want to do that? Some go even more daring enough to wear ripped short-shorts.

It's not that pants were made only for men from the beginning. I'm saying that uni-sex culture is wrong. In fact, some people (probably even James Dobson) said that unisex culture opens the door to homosexuality. But, I don't compare women to alcohol.

Say, what are you guys ideas about the "attire of a harlot" mentioned in Proverbs 7? (And please don't misunderstand me. I don't believe pants on women is harlot's attire!)

[Eleventh Doctor]

Women can be tempted by the lust of the flesh as well, why is there never any talk of men dressing more modestly? Why is it always on the women? Why when youth groups put out modesty rules the women's list is about twice as long?

JH your definition of nudity is extreme outside of the most strict Muslim countries. Also you've admitted that my point about rape in countries where burkas are the norm is true so how can you continue to put the responsibility on the women? How do people in church allow it? Women don't belong to the people in church, you aren't comparing women to alcohol but you are objectifying them. Also just because you think the Apocrypha says something that doesn't carry extra weight with me.

Are you really claiming that there aren't modest pants? How would you know? You've admitted you can't even tell the difference between men and women's pants.

Pants have been made for women at different times in history, just as skirts have been made for men at different times in history. We've been over this, did you just ignore everything we've been discussing? How in the world does women wearing pants open the door to homosexuality? That's a ridiculous argument.

No you don't compare women to alcohol, you just demean them and accuse them of creating lust if they wear anything besides a double layered dress. Have you ever talked to a woman or a girl about these views? Have you ever gotten to know one without judging them about how they look?

[John Henry]

1. My definition of nudity is misunderstood. In fact, it's not as rigid as you think it is.
2. True, pants have been worn in different cases, and it's not women wearing pants that is the problem. The problem is that women's clothes and men's clothes have clashed. I've seen men wearing women's pants, and women wearing men's pants so I see no difference in the clothing.

[Wakko]

1. My definition of nudity is misunderstood. In fact, it's not as rigid as you think it is.

I think it's very rigid and misunderstood. Nudity is when you have no clothes on whatsoever. Your definition of nudity is if you are wearing shorts or something. =p